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Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12131	Posted - 2015.03.14 01:22:44 - [1] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: we should call it what it is - a grief dec. EVE is a PvP game. PvP is, by definition, not griefing. The rest of your post is just you repeating one delusional lie after another, so I cut it out. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12132	Posted - 2015.03.14 05:52:55 - [2] - Quote Madd Adda wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Basil Pupkin wrote: we should call it what it is - a grief dec. EVE is a PvP game. PvP is, by definition, not griefing. The rest of your post is just you repeating one delusional lie after another, so I cut it out. no, EVE a sandbox that ALLOWS pvp. big difference. No, EVE is a PvP game. The freaking FAQ says as much. There is no argument about this, no debate. EVE is a PvP game first, last, and always. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12132	Posted - 2015.03.14 09:51:28 - [3] - Quote Thorn en Distel wrote: Seriously... of course there is griefing in player versus player combat, tons of it even. Nope. "Griefing", as defined by CCP, is an actionable offense. Since none of those things you're describing are in fact against any rules in EVE Online, it follows that they are not griefing. Quote: I AM a hardcore PVPer. And I consider the above griefing, not PVP. It's abusing existing mechanics to generate fights the opponent cannot win so you can boost your ego on fake achievements. There's another term for you. Spaceship Samurai. But fortunately, EVE Online is not a game in which I have to kowtow to someone else's definitions. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12133	Posted - 2015.03.14 11:48:57 - [4] - Quote Thorn en Distel wrote: I just have issues with EVE. It shows. This is paranoia on a whole other level, dude. Especially the part where you absolutely refuse to accept any risk that isn't dictated by you in advance. (which condemning other people who do the same) It would not be a stretch for me to say that EVE is not for you. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12133	Posted - 2015.03.14 11:59:10 - [5] - Quote Thorn en Distel wrote: Mate, a lot of the stuff you get away with in EVE will get you insta-banned in any other game. Oh, really? When I still played World of Warcraft with my wife, I once followed someone across the entire game server for 7 consecutive hours, ganking him all the while. My only reason? He pissed me off by taking an herbalism node. When he brought a GM in, the GM laughed and said "PvP happens on PvP servers." Even in WoW, one of the most legendarily wussy of MMOs, you can PvP freely within the rules. EVE's rules are simply more broad, with more avenues of attack. Quote: You may not consider it to be griefing, hell, the EVE devs may not consider it to be griefing, but you're all in a rather small minority, even for full-on PVP games (which EVE really, really isn't). Which kinda explains the problem with new player retention too. Yeah, no. You do not get to define your own terms here. Only CCP's definition matters in this context, you can wave whichever dictionary you like at me. PvP activity in this game, within the rules set by CCP, is not griefing by definition. Whether your attitude agrees or not. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12133	Posted - 2015.03.14 12:01:19 - [6] - Quote Thorn en Distel wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Thorn en Distel wrote: I just have issues with EVE. It shows. This is paranoia on a whole other level, dude. Especially the part where you absolutely refuse to accept any risk that isn't dictated by you in advance. (which condemning other people who do the same) It would not be a stretch for me to say that EVE is not for you. I think you're rather confusing things here. This game leaves you a lot of different paths to walk. I chose the NPC corp route, which is perfectly legitimate. It denies you certain options, but also gives you a few others. Just because those are not the options YOU chose, does not mean they are invalid. Or that EVE is not for people who don't do things your way That whooshing sound was the sound of the point going over your head. I was talking about your little rant about how you WILL NOT do all variety of things, etc, etc. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12133	Posted - 2015.03.14 12:18:56 - [7] - Quote Thorn en Distel wrote: Not doing those things is a valid choice in this game. You still misunderstand. Your insistence to not share EVE with anyone you know, based solely on those hideous misconceptions about how the game works, is what I find to be both sad and bewildering. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12134	Posted - 2015.03.14 22:58:48 - [8] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: And the definition of sandbox is everyone is allowed to play the way they want. Nope. You can try to succeed at whatever you want. But you don't get to automatically succeed at whatever you try. Since EVE is a PvP game, other people get to have their say. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12135	Posted - 2015.03.15 00:57:25 - [9] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: While I do not talk about war decs, grief decs I believe to be #1 source of bad retention. You believe wrong. CCP themselves have stated that they can find zero link between non consensual PvP and retention. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12137	Posted - 2015.03.15 01:48:33 - [10] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: If you are so much into pvp why are you hiding in hi-sec and avoiding other like minded individuals. Oh, that's easy. Because highsec has more targets, and more deserving targets. No one needs PvP visited on them more than the people who insist that it shouldn't happen. Cry more about how I'm allowed to make a choice you don't like. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12137	Posted - 2015.03.15 02:21:01 - [11] - Quote Harrison Tato wrote: Whatever floats your boat. I think he was being infintile because the idea of another player ignoring or avoiding him hurts his feewwwingsss. *infantile. At least spell it correctly, if you're going to try and insult me. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12137	Posted - 2015.03.15 02:29:37 - [12] - Quote Niobe Song wrote: Why do NPC corps bother people so much? Their risk/reward ratio is hugely skewed. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12137	Posted - 2015.03.15 03:17:05 - [13] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: You are in hi-sec killing players who don't fight back vs being in low or null fighting other pvp players. You should be the last one to talk about risk. Its obvious you are risk averse. I wasn't aware that people we wardec are forbidden from shooting back. My level of risk is theirs to dictate, after all. Their failure in that regard belongs solely to them. And heck, if you're talking about ganking, there is no riskier profession. Neg tens can be shot by literally anyone without recourse. Such projection from you. Here you are arguing that risk should be taken away, and saying that disagreement is itself risk averse. Do you think anyone will fall for that lie? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12137	Posted - 2015.03.15 03:35:42 - [14] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: If you are a new player with one account, losing a cruiser or BC or your first T1 battleship can be a major setback. And there's no way for a collection of such players to fight back against t3 gangs so, they get to just not play for a week or two. Some of you folk can't imagine what its like to play without a half dozen alts minimum. Never heard of the Griffon, I take it? Most wardec corps are pretty little, so even a relatively small corp can have numbers on them, and ewar leverages numbers better than almost anything else you can do in highsec. Yes, there are things you can do when decced. Just because they don't constitute being able to ignore wardecs completely doesn't mean it's not a viable way to do it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12138	Posted - 2015.03.15 04:06:59 - [15] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Once again, if highsec newbie corps were filled with players who understand pvp tactics and fleet doctrines, we wouldn't be having this discussion. And? Are you suggesting that they simply be immune? Or that they should be able to win when playing the game incorrectly? It seems fairly simple to me. New players need to be taught, not by one another obviously. Why should a corp unsuitable for this do well? If they are weeded out, it leaves more room for the worthwhile corps to recruit. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12138	Posted - 2015.03.15 04:16:15 - [16] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: It's not that hard to run a locator and move a neutral scout around in a frig on your second monitor. Especially if you know your target is a dumbass who doesn't understand how game of alts works or what locators do. Of course it's not hard, but we just aren't that important on an individual level either. New players joining nee player Corps are going to struggle. I agree with you that it would be good if there were some minimum requirements to start a Corp. That would result in a lot of change in the view of wardecs. Bingo. A lot of the problems with "new player corps" is that the bar is set so low for corp creation. It trivializes the mechanic. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12138	Posted - 2015.03.15 05:01:36 - [17] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Who's to do the teaching if all the bittervets are busy farming them for stats? Oh puh-leez. Of all of the mid-high skillpoint players in highsec right now, I very much doubt than even 10% of them are in wardec corps. It's probably lower than that. Quote: I think some sort of tweak to the wardec system that disincentivizes deccing corps low in SP and assets would solve the problem. And I think that CCP themselves have stated that non consensual PvP has no ramifications on player retention. And that taking player freedom away to serve the purely theoretical purpose of "helping newbies" is disingenuous at best. Quote: It would be nice if the bittervets would make a conscious decision to challenge themselves instead of going after the easy targets, but risk-aversion is just as ingrained in their playstyle as it is in that of the "carebears." And here you are mischaracterizing the motives of people you don't like. If you hadn't yet figured this out, far more people do the former, than the latter. Ever heard of Eve University? RvB? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12141	Posted - 2015.03.15 12:43:48 - [18] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: You are in a free ship and risk nothing. Uh, what? Hate to break it to you, but I paid for the Sacrileges that I fly during wars, and while they're notoriously cost effective, they're not exactly easy on the wallet if I lose them repeatedly. (yet to have that happen, fortunately, but then I've been absent the past month thanks to computer and pregnant wife issues) Quote: Gankers never have any risk, even loot fairy they complain about every time is averaging in the long run. Except for how, since most of us are free targets to literally anyone in the game, we have more risk than any other profession. It does not reflect on the mechanical level of risk that we accept that other people don't have the balls to do anything about it. I swear, with people like you playing the game, we could fly around in totally tankless ships and not have to worry about it. Oh wait, we do, because you thumbless cowards never bother shooting back. There is no other profession in the entire game that suffers under as many mechanical consequences for their actions as suicide gankers. Quote: And yes, targets of grief dec are carefully selected to have no ability to shoot back. There is no such thing a "grief dec", wardecs are not griefing by definition. Also, you'd be surprised at just how often it's rather the opposite of your claim. Quote: even though they can do nothing to you while you use invulnerability exploit. Oh yes, I forgot that you think docking itself is an exploit. Do you honestly think that anyone takes you seriously when you're rambling that kind of nonsense? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12142	Posted - 2015.03.16 00:17:07 - [19] - Quote Hasikan Miallok wrote: Players who are unsuited to EVE and will never really enjoy it tend to hang around an NPC corp till they finally quit. Forcing them to move to a Player Corp will not miraculously transform them into EVE fans - you will be just be lumbering Player corps with a batch of uncommitted whiny players who will eventually quit anyway becasue the game does not actually suit them. If they'll quit eventually anyway, then who cares? CCP needs to be targeting the type of person who is interested in EVE, to get them engaged in the game quickly, instead of boring them to death too. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12142	Posted - 2015.03.16 01:58:55 - [20] - Quote ashley Eoner wrote: Ganking is an entirely risk free endeavor when done properly. So is almost everything else in the game. If you play the game correctly, you will almost never die in highsec. (barring someone really dedicated going after you with smartbombs on a gate, or some such) So yeah, condemn just gankers for playing the game well, hypocrite. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12144	Posted - 2015.03.16 02:37:22 - [21] - Quote ashley Eoner wrote: There's at least a thousand things that could cause a loss in eve that is out of your control.. Unless said person is a ganker, in which case they're just magically immune according to you, right? Trip over yourself more. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12144	Posted - 2015.03.16 04:06:11 - [22] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: Also as long as there is no real benefit to a high sec corp people won't join high sec corps. And if you push the NPC tax higher, people will just make more 1 man corps, which they will then recycle when wardecced. If you push the NPC tax higher AND remove the ability to evade wardecs, people will just quit rather than be griefed like the current cycle creates. You've literally talked yourself into a corner. People won't join player corps because highsec corps aren't worth it compared to NPC corps. But. If they nerf NPC corps to make player corps more attractive, you claim that will make people quit. What intellectually dishonest rationale. You're trying to paint a picture whereby only nerfing wardecs, already one of the weakest mechanics in the game, is the only way forward, and that's just patently untrue. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12144	Posted - 2015.03.16 05:50:00 - [23] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Your first point is unprovable speculation. ... which I said specifically in response to your "all the bittervets are just farming noobs", which was an obvious lie. Don't make ** up, and then claim that anyone correcting your obvious lie is in the wrong. Quote: RvB and Eve uni are great but they're not enough, it's mostly a few white knights herding hordes of newbies about and hoping to win by sheer number of tech 1 hulls. So the what? They have tons of fun doing that, why are you spitting at it? That's how newbies can be effective, or would you rather they just mine for the first year of playing the game? Quote: And they are resources that have to be actively sought out by new players - many of the players who get slaughtered by wardecs in highsec are the type that don't want to treat a game like a second job and frankly don't understand what's happening to them. Oh, bullshit. The new player help channel exists, and just about anyone you ask about it will point you towards one of those groups. Quote:** Why don't you want good fights Kaarous? Why should your definition of "good fight" be permitted to tie my hands? Or anyone else's? Why are you an emotional fascist, trying to force how you want to play the game on other people? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12144	Posted - 2015.03.16 06:21:29 - [24] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: A good fight is one that involves an opponent who has the knowledge, experience and resources to be a challenge. Also known as "people highsec griefers don't shoot at if they can possibly avoid it." And yet again with the deliberate falsehoods. Quote: How is shooting the clueless in badly fit t1 ships any different than shooting red crosses or rocks? I just don't understand why you think its such an important part of the game. I don't understand why you hate player freedom. Or why you play EVE in the first place if you hate the sandbox so much. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12146	Posted - 2015.03.16 07:16:20 - [25] - Quote Before Demerius comes back in here to tell me what he thinks I believe, I'll go ahead and summarize it: I have no problem shooting at people who can shoot back. What I do have a problem with is petty little videogame fascists who want to tell me who I should or shouldn't be able to shoot at. And since those people very often coincide with the people who would like to see my ability to shoot at them disappear entirely, they become preferred targets. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12149	Posted - 2015.03.16 22:12:58 - [26] - Quote Prince Kobol wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Before Demerius comes back in here to tell me what he thinks I believe, I'll go ahead and summarize it: I have no problem shooting at people who can shoot back. What I do have a problem with is petty little videogame fascists who want to tell me who I should or shouldn't be able to shoot at. And since those people very often coincide with the people who would like to see my ability to shoot at them disappear entirely, they become preferred targets. You do realise that are you also trying to tell people how they should play Nope. What I'm asking is that NPC corps not be the most viable choice for almost everything in highsec. You know, so that cooperative play is incentivized, since CCP has told us that solo PvE playstyle hurt retention. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12156	Posted - 2015.03.17 11:50:26 - [27] - Quote Sibyyl wrote: Y'all want to keep telling Kaarous and Scip that they're making stuff up? Of course they want to keep telling me that. Feels > Reals for these people. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12157	Posted - 2015.03.17 12:20:07 - [28] - Quote Thora Zhubilai wrote: But there are also the reasons why a lot of newcomers leavesGÇª Nope. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12163	Posted - 2015.03.17 22:13:11 - [29] - Quote Vincent Athena wrote: Oddly, CCP says they cannot verify that griefing drives away players, then make a change to the game designed to reduce griefing, all in the name of player retention! Nope. I can still reverse awox newbies just as easily, and corp thief just as easily. It was, in fact, intended to get more people into player corps, which just goes to prove my point that even CCP can't ignore the problem any longer. Whether it was successful or whether it was the right move, could be contested. But the reason was not "griefing", if you even took a cursory read through their rationale. But I know full well that you and every other carebear didn't, you just saw what you wanted to see. Feels > Reals, in full display. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12173	Posted - 2015.03.19 00:12:34 - [30] - Quote DeMichael Crimson wrote: Granted we can't be WarDec'd but on the other hand we also can't WarDec other corps. Being exempt from that comes with a price. As I said earlier, NPC Corp members can't own or access POS / Outposts. That's your defense? Really? That you get the dubious benefit of not being able to use the single most broken game mechanic in MMO history? Yeah, that's some penalty all right, in exchange for total immunity to wardecs thereby eliminating half the risk left in highsec. That totally sounds fair to me, a shining example of game balance and all that. Quote: Don't know why Player Corps are so dead set against NPC Corps. Because the playstyles that are enabled by the existing NPC corp mechanics are bad for the game. They damage player retention, that's not even up for argument anymore, it's a fact. If the game wants to obtain better retention, the sacred cow you're clinging to will have to be addressed eventually. Quote: Since this game is a sandbox I have the right to play it as I see fit. If CCP starts forcing players to play this game a certain way then it's no longer a sandbox. Removing the players right to choose is not good for the game. Forcing players to leave NPC Corp will only cause more people to quit. You're already causing people to quit by boring them to death. CCP might as well do something about it. People like you have been arguing for stripping away player choice when it benefits you, and now that philosophy gets to bite you in the ass. The time is coming when you lot will have to pay the piper. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12173	Posted - 2015.03.19 02:19:13 - [31] - Quote DeMichael Crimson wrote: Heh, the single most broken game mechanic in this game is allowing players in corps like yours to do high sec ganking indefinitely with impunity. No, it's still the POS system. There really isn't anything in contemporary gaming that compares with just how awful the POS system is. Quote: What's damaging player retention in this game are people like you and the corp you belong to, constantly ganking miners and industrials in high sec and then go sit in station and use Security Tags while waiting for the criminal flag to expire. Literally, nope. You people need to find a different lie, I'm afraid. Quote: The only one that's boring people here is you. As for making people quit, we've already established that it's people in corps like yours. See the above. Better luck next time, carebear. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12173	Posted - 2015.03.19 02:21:32 - [32] - Quote Eli Stan wrote: Nowhere in that statement is a cause of player isolation identified. snipped rant Didn't even read what you quoted, did you? The playstyles enabled by NPC corps are bad for the game. Go ahead and take another crack at it, I'll wait. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12173	Posted - 2015.03.19 02:57:11 - [33] - Quote GetSirrus wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: People like you have been arguing for stripping away player choice when it benefits you, and now that philosophy gets to bite you in the ass. How is the choice to remain a NPC, robbing the choice of someone else to leave it? Now that is some impressive effort to miss the point. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12173	Posted - 2015.03.19 07:09:59 - [34] - Quote Niobe Song wrote: I don't really see CCP removing the NPC corps so CODE terrorist guy and the others are flailing about pointlessly. I don't really see where in this thread I've suggested that NPC corps be removed. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12176	Posted - 2015.03.19 23:05:48 - [35] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: You statement only makes sense if wardecs are the only form of consequence. No, just fully half of it. I think that's sufficiently significant as to warrant a discussion. Especially given just how very little is given up in exchange for the immunity to wardecs. And I'm still curious as to when I claimed that NPC corps should be removed, like people keep saying. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12178	Posted - 2015.03.20 01:26:56 - [36] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Since it isn't a universal choice for 2 of the 3 professions you mention can we then assume your statement is false? Pretty sure the people who are dec dodging are being considered in that category as well, since that's a widely used fringe benefit of NPC corps. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12178	Posted - 2015.03.20 01:35:56 - [37] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: That's a separate subject regarding the limits of wardecs, but still harder in concept for either of us to prove how prolific it is. To be honest I'd say the deck dodger in a loot pinata running missions is better fodder for "content" than the player who just logs off for a week, but I'd even more assume that the bulk of highsec corps are nobodies and are quite content with that as it doesn't draw attention like wardecs. But again, all anecdotal. As a member of code I'm sure your experience is different, but code itself provokes those responses by design so... I would argue that they are not separate subjects. They're very closely tied in with one another, as they the defining features of wardecs and NPC corps relate to each other, respectively. Discussion of one entails discussion of the other. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12180	Posted - 2015.03.20 01:49:59 - [38] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: That doesn't address the point that neither of us has data regarding the subject at hand so even if you move the goalpost from NPC corps to dec dodge corps the answer doesn't change. I'm not moving anything. I'm introducing an element for consideration that you had overlooked. The point is that NPC corps, whatever else some people may use them for, currently facilitate extreme risk aversion, solo and antisocial playstyles, and hamper interaction with the playerbase at large. And I believe that needs looked at. CCP believes it too, or they wouldn't be making so many pushes to get more people (new players especially), into player corps. But we can't actually have the discussion because people are so intent on derailing, deflecting and derogating that we can't even move forward with the basic premise. I get it, people want to defend their golden goose. Too bad, it's going to happen, just like ISBoxer did, because the way it works right now is bad for the game. People in this thread can get in on the discussion now or after the dev blog drops, their choice. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12180	Posted - 2015.03.20 02:23:21 - [39] - Quote Commander Spurty wrote: Go to low sec, null sec or wormhole space. 75% of space is yours to go pew pew in. Wrong. 100% of space is mine to go pew pew in, because EVE Online is a PvP game. Basil Pumpkin wrote: You do realize he won't have joined CODE after being booted out of ROC if he weren't scaredof going low/null/wh? Entirely false. I left of my own accord, with good relations with my former alliance. Ask them if you don't believe me. Regardless, cease your lies. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12180	Posted - 2015.03.20 02:58:28 - [40] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: because everyone knows you don't join CODE if you're good for anything other than F1 monkeyism against a gunless target. And behold, the shocking intellectual dishonesty of carebears, ladies and gentlemen. It is impossible that anyone would hold a contradictory viewpoint in any honesty, according to Basil here. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12181	Posted - 2015.03.20 03:14:54 - [41] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: Basil Pupkin wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: 100% of space is mine to go pew pew in, because EVE Online is a PvP game. Quoted to be wrong by CCP Seagull herself in today's fanfest stream. Except that he isn't wrong. Shh, don't let facts get in the way of his ranting. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12184	Posted - 2015.03.20 03:41:23 - [42] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: This suggests the solution is in player hands via veteran engagement. Quite the opposite. It suggests that thus far, the only mitigating factor in favor of NPC corps is completely player created and player driven. That is just how badly CCP has failed in this regard. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12184	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:03:05 - [43] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: New players have to start somewhere, and that should ideally be somewhere neutral rather than pushing new players to established metagame sides or behavioral preferences. I agree. Problem is, right now it's overwhelmingly pushing people to PvE, solitary, boredom oriented playstyles. And, since the majority of the NPC corps they can end up in do nothing to change that, their subscription dies of boredom. That has to change. You can't just handwave it away by saying "well CCP should fix the NPE", because NPC corps are a fundamental part of the NPE. Quote: But most importantly, it still doesn't ensure a positive experience for new players in player corps because there are terrible player corps out there and genuine new players are going to have issues determining those from the good ones. Yeah, which is why we should be pushing to empower people to be able to destroy such corps. You know, have something to fight for that can engage new players in the game, instead of making them mine for three months until they quit. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12184	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:06:09 - [44] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: *sneezing noise Gesundheit. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12184	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:13:06 - [45] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: As stated, new players have to go somewhere and if veterans decide to not be there CCP can't fail as success was never an option WE provided them. New players do have to go somewhere, exactly. So why does that place have to be this sedentary, PvE focused group, every single time for every new player? Why is it that if you join this game to do something besides peck at rocks all goddamn day, you have to ask the EVE subreddit how to do it? That's not our fault as players. It's CCP's fault for allowing this stagnation, for not taking an axe to this sacred cow a long time ago. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12184	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:19:22 - [46] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Actually, I thought I was pretty clearly on the path that CCP can't fix most of the NPE. If the NPE needs social interaction to work, it needs people to be social with and since not much is preventing that, what more can CCP do? The way NPC corps work right now is a large factor in anti social behavior. They, along with the NPE, need to be reworked to offer a more social experience with more potential for conflict and in-space player interaction, not just jawing on in the shared chat channel. Quote: You have presented another contradiction though. Through the destruction of lesser social groups do you think retention will be helped or hurt? Helped. My ideal solution would likely result in the dissolution of about 50% of the currently existing corps in highsec. Quote: Creating scenarios designed to destroy a group and it's member without a way out Who said anything about no way out? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12185	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:29:50 - [47] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Actually yes, it is the fault of players if you subscribe to the logic that social interaction drives retention. Social interaction does drive retention. And they're being set up for failure because of the way NPC corps work right now, and because the tutorials push people into PvE. Those two things combined are a death sentence for subscriptions, even CCP acknowledges this. Quote: It seems you do agree that existing social groups shouldn't get free members. I certainly don't think that new players should start in EVE Uni, if that's what you mean. But that does not preclude us from improving upon the deeply flawed current rules of NPC corps. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12185	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:31:26 - [48] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: So you think destroying current social ties will help and believe you can do so without removing the ease of escape? If you have an idea please propose it. First of all, you already acknowledged that such corps are not social ties. They're just toxic newbie tax farms. Secondly, yes, I believe that making highsec corps something worth fighting for, instead of a glorified chat channel, is the way forward for improved social interaction and thereby retention. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12185	Posted - 2015.03.20 04:42:34 - [49] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: I want you to very explicitly describe the process you are claiming happens and the attributes of an NPC corp specifically that drive that process. You stated the NPE pushes people into PvE, which I can agree with, but that says nothing of NPC corps. The NPE could be gutted without touching the NPC corps. So how do they, the corps, specifically feed into this. I need to know how that works, not just what you claim the ends are, to make sense of this. Are you serious? Okay, laid out for you: NPC corps are immune to wars. Therefore, they attract people who do not want to engage in any PvP or player interaction in general. These people, whose whole reason for being in an NPC corp is to avoid player interaction, are the first people that newbies see, the first group they get to interact with. Get it yet? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12186	Posted - 2015.03.20 05:05:36 - [50] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Thanks for the demonstration that this is again a social issue. Nothing about the corps themselves is the issue, it's people. Still off base. We should not be enabling this, and certainly should not be enabling such people being the ones with prime access to new players. It needs to be addressed, because CCP has already established for us that it's a problem. Quote: And what keeps veterans from creating characters to counter the supposed carebear influence? Because we actually like to play the game. Those of us who enjoy wardecs and PvP cannot do so in an NPC corp barring suicide ganking. We are effectively forbidden from interacting with new players at the basic stage of development. That needs to change, that's my whole point in all of this. The new player experience needs to stop being exclusively carebear friendly, and that means changing NPC corps. Quote: All I can think of is consolidating the corps and allowing more vets to join at least in being in the channels. Consolidation is one step, yes. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12186	Posted - 2015.03.20 05:13:49 - [51] - Quote Eli Stan wrote: Okay, so how does forcing And the strawman again. I'm not even going to bother responding to your theoretical rebuttal to points that I didn't make. Quote: And how do these newbies see the interaction-avoiding veterans if the veterans never interact? You ever been in Hedion during primetime, or hell, off time? They don't, that's the whole point. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12187	Posted - 2015.03.20 05:19:48 - [52] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: The only aspect of this that is an issue, if even that, is the wardec immunity, and even that has a justification. So you can either exclude vets and further isolate new players or remove the immunity and throw new players into a conflict they have no way of understanding. Which of those is a positive? Why would they have no way of understanding it? Oh, that's right, because the thrice damned tutorial is not worth squat for how to actually play the game besides shooting at red crosses and eating rocks. These are not separate issues, for the very last time. They are inter-related, and changing one necessitates a revision of the other. Quote: Actually no, you could use heavy taxing, but that again creates an issue with veteran presence as anytime you are making isk you aren't engaging with new players and still not doing so when wanting wardec PvP. Personally, I'd make it a tax based on character age. Anyone older than ninety days(or whatever arbitrary timeframe CCP decides on) would receive a heavier tax rate than the rest. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12189	Posted - 2015.03.20 08:19:33 - [53] - Quote Eli Stan wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Personally, I'd make it a tax based on character age. Anyone older than ninety days(or whatever arbitrary timeframe CCP decides on) would receive a heavier tax rate than the rest. Take it for what it's worth, but I consider that a form of trying to "force" players out of their NPC corp, despite retaining the ability to remain in said corp. Call my description a straw man argument if you like, but I'm stating my personal interpretation of the process. No, that's how you keep people from abusing it as they do now, to dramatically increase their own safety. The thing is, whichever way this comes down, it will be a net nerf. CCP has to make player corps worth having. And right now, player corps in highsec are worth nothing more than a chat channel, a corp hangar, and the dubious privilege of being able to setup poses. Meanwhile NPC corps have everything else plus immune to wardecs. Something has to give, and it's going to be safety or profitability, or both. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12189	Posted - 2015.03.20 08:29:33 - [54] - Quote Niobe Song wrote: Looks more like Eve is a PvE game where PvP sometimes happens. That's not a good way of arguing that highsec should stay safe. All you've really done is prove us right when we claim that things need rebalanced to favor player conflict. Besides, which, what people do has no effect on the nature of the game. I can wear a lampshade on my head, and it's still a lampshade, not a hat. I can wear it 22 hours a day, and it's still not a hat, no matter how much I misuse the product. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12191	Posted - 2015.03.20 10:06:53 - [55] - Quote Niobe Song wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Niobe Song wrote: Looks more like Eve is a PvE game where PvP sometimes happens. That's not a good way of arguing that highsec should stay safe. All you've really done is prove us right when we claim that things need rebalanced to favor player conflict. Besides, which, what people do has no effect on the nature of the game. I can wear a lampshade on my head, and it's still a lampshade, not a hat. I can wear it 22 hours a day, and it's still not a hat, no matter how much I misuse the product. Or if you want more player conflict you can move out of high sec. No. EVE is a PvP game, and PvP belongs everywhere. That includes highsec. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12195	Posted - 2015.03.20 11:22:10 - [56] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: He is made useless by mechanics preventing any usefulness below certain amount of SP, that I named "SP wall". To make matters worse, "SP wall" grows every year, so if you're not gaining SP, you may also become useless, even if you weren't before. It also ensures that if you gain SP slower than the next guy, you will stay useless and locked out of combat pvp (edge case scenarios aside, you will always reliably die to SP wall) forever. That's the nature of that sandbox game called EVE. Combat pvp niche is occupied, you may become content or have better luck next game, sucks to be below 105 million SP. To any new player reading this, the entire quoted post is an enormous lie. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12198	Posted - 2015.03.20 12:46:35 - [57] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: Knowledge of mechanics. You don't have any. Heck, you are on record as claiming that docking is an exploit. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12204	Posted - 2015.03.20 13:16:22 - [58] - Quote And look at the conspiracy theories fly. Hey guys, turns out that new players, or anyone without 105million skillpoints, isn't actually effective at the game. That's just a lie told by everyone in the game... for the past decade. He actually finds this easier to believe than the truth that new players and low skillpoint pilots can be effective. Meanwhile, I find it hard to believe that anyone can actually be that bad at EVE. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12208	Posted - 2015.03.20 13:39:23 - [59] - Quote Aralyn Cormallen wrote: There is a reason groups like us, TEST, and Brave, which have massively higher retention rates than the norm for the game as a whole, get our newbies the hell out of that environment as fast as humanly possible. Bingo. And that's what this is all about. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12221	Posted - 2015.03.21 11:50:06 - [60] - Quote Gardav wrote: Do you know WHY some of us are "anti-social" as you call it in EVE? snip While that might be your case in particular, CCP disagrees that it's a widespread issue. If you find it so objectionable to be shot at in a PvP game, that simply can't be helped. But do not try to claim it's the general rule, as so many carebears before you have done so dishonestly. Because it quite simply isn't true. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 12233	Posted - 2015.03.22 12:34:24 - [61] - Quote Basil Pupkin wrote: The retention of people who are ready to become content in form of providing easy kills of themselves to an SP wall mechanics - is already peak, and doesn't need any further improvement. Note the pure, unadulterated selfishness inherent in this statement. Translates easily into "we already have too many of those people I don't like". "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13035	Posted - 2015.05.20 00:55:20 - [62] - Quote Drazok wrote: Code/losers ganking miners in high sec pushes players out of the game or least away from pvp. Literally, nope. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13045	Posted - 2015.05.20 17:41:19 - [63] - Quote Avaelica Kuershin wrote: Please go and learn the difference between correlation and causation. Please learn what that phrase actually means, instead of spouting pseudo intellectual nonsense at people who actually have a clue. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13056	Posted - 2015.05.21 12:37:08 - [64] - Quote JBM Holdings wrote: Because they want too and this is (should) be a game a where a player can/should be able to play as he/she wishes without some dumbass trying to **** in their sand. Wrong. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13059	Posted - 2015.05.22 02:03:42 - [65] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: What I don't understand, is where you get off telling/forcing me to play your way. No one is saying that except your own side, it's a painfully obvious strawman by now. What we would like, however, is for NPC corps to not be the obviously better choice for almost everything. You know, that little thing called game balance. The rest of your post is just you ranting against the position that no one is actually taking. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13059	Posted - 2015.05.22 03:03:11 - [66] - Quote Aza Ebanu wrote: I can't tell you how many CEOs get into this game thinking that they are going to be at the top and hire players to work for them while they profit. They have no clue about the game, and they contribute to the worst EVE experiences ever. I can tell you. I was an awoxer for a long time, before CCP decided that should not be a thing anymore, so I've dealt with more than my fair share of them. It's the vast majority of them. It's why I've argued for a while to put corp creation behind a harder barrier of entry. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13066	Posted - 2015.05.22 23:58:12 - [67] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: I think the notion that involvement with player corps leads to greater retention is erroneous. Data isn't invalid just because it contradicts what you want to be true. Quote: Unfortunately, I can't shake the sneaking suspicion that all the attempts to force PvE into player corps via oppressive tax rates are just a thinly veiled demand that CCP provide more easy targets for highsec pvp. Of course you do. Without that silly strawman, you apologists have no real argument. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13066	Posted - 2015.05.23 00:02:26 - [68] - Quote Hells bells, even if it were true that people just want to make highsec pvp more accessible and more widespread by giving NPC corps the nerf they have deserved for half a decade... How is that a bad thing? PvP activity is undeniably the best path to better player retention anyways. If your interests are in the way of that, sucks to be you for standing in the way of improving the game. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13067	Posted - 2015.05.23 00:33:09 - [69] - Quote Scipio Artelius wrote: Many player Corps are possibly worse than starter Corps, but that's an issue about discovery of the good Corps that the game currently handles very poorly. I would instead argue that is an issue with a lack of attrition being enforceable against bad player corps. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13069	Posted - 2015.05.23 00:41:14 - [70] - Quote If, for example, wars could not be dodged, and people were forced to use the surrender mechanic as it was intended. Within half a year, the highsec corps that were left would be ones that you know have passed the test, and could be counted on to be worthwhile to their members. Pointing people towards good corps is all well and good as an idea, but enabling the removal of the oh-so-many bad corps from the pool is far more important. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13069	Posted - 2015.05.23 00:56:05 - [71] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Casual corps have a right to exist. They literally don't. That's what chat channels are for. Player corps are for when you are ready to take a step into the larger world. Quote: Your suggestion is nothing more than a way to break any corp that can't fight or join a major alliance... Which is pretty much any corp that is not in a major alliance.. My suggestion is to remove the parasites who use newbies as tax farms, who prey on them by making them mine for months and lie to them that new players can't/shouldn't PvP. Especially when such people stand directly in the way of improving player retention, and the betterment of the game as a whole.n Why do they deserve to exist, when all they do is hurt the game itself and grief newbies with toxic attitudes and boredom centric playstyles? Enabling that bullshit is not what any game that wants to keep existing would do. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13069	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:00:26 - [72] - Quote beakerax wrote: - leadership which is most interested in enriching itself rather than providing content for their members This is the big one. Speaking as a prolific corp thief and awoxer, I say with confidence that this is 90% or more of existing corps in highsec. They are used as newbie tax farms, and they are griefing new players right out of the game with the weaponized boredom this game calls PvE "content". "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13072	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:13:50 - [73] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: So, casual players, new players and people that don't run five alts need not apply. Not with an attitude like yours, no. Everyone else is welcome. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13072	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:17:27 - [74] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: So, your assertion is that they don't have a right to exist because they don't fit your definition of what is right. No, they don't have a right to exist, period. Moreso if they're actively hurting the game, which they are. Quote: I would like to note that most high sec, casual corps, have a 0% tax rate I would like to note that the statement I just quoted is a lie. Quote: Grinding lvl 4 missions solo isn't all that grand. However, when you have a fleet, regardless of the payout, it is much more enjoyable. No one does that for long. Deliberately hurting your income just for the sake of adding another body into an already banal mechanic is a recipe for nothing worth doing. Quote: This is, again, and example of self proclaimed PVP elitists attempting to dictate what is Eve. As opposed to the kinds of backwards excuses for gamers that try to claim that mining is fun? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13072	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:22:13 - [75] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: Keeping npc corps are good for Eve, that's all there is to say about it. Well, aside from the part where CCP themselves tell us that they are bad for EvE, sure. Well, that and the part where you have to back up your statements with something more than a handful of ad hominem attacks against the people disagreeing with you. You know, facts. Like CCP showed us, the ones that show that NPC corps are bad for the game. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13072	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:24:49 - [76] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: It might also be noted that the very corps you're trying to rid Eve of, often take more risks just by existing than many corps that exist in low/null/wh space. It might also be noted that what you just said is utter bullshit. Highsec is so safe it's nauseating. Quote: There are literally hundreds of corps, outside of high sec, that do exactly what casual high sec corps do. Only, they do it under the protection and banner of an alliance. Grr, other people having friends. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13076	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:26:53 - [77] - Quote Do you freaking hear yourself? Sitting there, pouting and demanding the kinds of things that people get in huge alliances, while demanding it for the literal lowest common denominator in the entire game? You do not deserve it. Simple as that. You don't deserve to exist, you don't deserve to be safe, and you don't deserve to be left alone by anyone, ever. Not unless you actually play the game and earn it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13076	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:28:26 - [78] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: They are good for new players, and denying that is pure fanboisim at its best. There's that ad hominem again, in lieu of anything resembling proof of your ludicrous statements. I reject your claim. I will not take what you say at face value, certainly not when CCP's own statements directly contradict it. Back it up, or gtfo. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13076	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:33:38 - [79] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Oh, ok... So you're allowed to suck at the game and not be condemned, so long as you're part of an uninvolved side of a group that doesn't suck.... They're putting in more effort, and accepting more risk. Yes, their reward ratio should be higher. That's called game balance. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13077	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:42:32 - [80] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: [ The point I tried to illustrate is that survival is not based on how well you play a video game, thus, the video game must not be a representation of your survival skills. First of all, you got trolled. Second of all, not a lot of people actually think that. While I dislike the attitude you display here, I don't know you from Adam. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13077	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:44:26 - [81] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: Its funny you use the word demanding when you are demanding other play the way you want them to. Nope, that's still you, demanding that we ignore the stats and the facts, and keep on the with the same failed paradigm we have been, just because it suits you. It's shameful. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13077	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:47:38 - [82] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: You seem to be under the impression that players should not be allowed to play the game at all, if they don't play in a manner that you dictate as "good". Wrong. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13077	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:50:52 - [83] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: You seem to be under the impression that players should not be allowed to play the game at all, if they don't play in a manner that you dictate as "good". Wrong. Well, I would like you to enlighten me on how your comments can lead me to believe otherwise. You might try actually reading them. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13077	Posted - 2015.05.23 01:55:26 - [84] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: You might try actually reading your own posts. Try reading yours. Directly arguing against improving player retention, because it means attention being paid to a part of the game you irrationally dislike. We've tried it your way for a decade, and it has been proven not to work. Time to go the other way for once. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13078	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:07:15 - [85] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: They don't leave station so it's irrelevant. I did say that all the bittervet combat support and hauler alts hiding in NPC corps should be at risk also, rather than ONLY the people flying industrials or mission boats in highsec as their primary activity. Why should people not generating income be brought up at all? Just because you want to be petulant about it? Risk vs reward purely reflects against income generating activities. Try as you might, you can't shift those goal posts. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13078	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:11:06 - [86] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: I copied everything you said. So logic dictates you are arguing against player retention because it means players playing a part of the game you irrationally dislike. Except for the part where CCP has outright said that your side is hurting retention, and mine is helping it. You know, since logic dictates, and all. Whether I dislike it or not is not relevant. I do, I hate this game's PvE with every ounce of my being. But my opinion doesn't matter, the facts do. And the facts say that PvE centric game design is boring subscriptions to death. The end. You lose. You can cry all you want about how you don't want it to be true, or how things shouldn't be changed because it would make me happy, but that doesn't change the truth. For whatever petty carebear reason you have concocted, you are the one standing in the way of making this game better. And now everyone knows it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13078	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:16:51 - [87] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: Where was the explicit statement that any specific individuals were hurting retention? I didn't say specific individuals, although I'd put down a few mil to suggest that a few of the more egregious carebear offenders in this thread have cost CCP a few subs. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13079	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:21:14 - [88] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: [ That's productive for conversation now isn't it. It's not supposed to be. Accept the facts, or don't. It doesn't matter to me which you choose. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13079	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:22:47 - [89] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: I have played Eve for 2 years...solo. According to CCPs analysis I should have been gone...but I am still here. So much for you data. Ah, I love when someone tries to claim that a personal anecdote invalidates hard data. Although it was funnier when that clown Dracvlad did it with Star Citizen forum dwellers, people who literally are not EVE players. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13079	Posted - 2015.05.23 02:23:56 - [90] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: So, your logic is that, since PVE content bores you to no end, it is deemed boring to everyone and therefore, at fault for everything. I'm not the one saying that. CCP is, I just happen to agree with them. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13099	Posted - 2015.05.23 10:23:16 - [91] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: They don't leave station so it's irrelevant. I did say that all the bittervet combat support and hauler alts hiding in NPC corps should be at risk also, rather than ONLY the people flying industrials or mission boats in highsec as their primary activity. Risk vs reward purely reflects against income generating activities. Well no. Risk vs. Reward should apply to kills and other forms of content more than meaningless space bux. It already does, that's what the Loot Fairy is for in the first place. But income generating activities, those things that you can do that add assets into the game world, those are what risk vs reward primarily targets. It exists to combat rampant inflation, because the economy is driven by loss. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13108	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:26:45 - [92] - Quote Nevil Oscillator wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: What I do see is a set of players accustomed to doing their destruction in high sec that see that becoming more difficult and requiring a little more effort, and they are understandably not happy about it. If I'd been playing longer and developed an entire playing style around violencing stupid in highsec I'd no doubt feel the same way. The answer is nerf high sec so that everyone can get in on the action and start shooting unarmed industrial ships to give them more competition. Making highsec PvP more accessible would help, whether you were joking about that or not. The only reason most of the existing wardec and ganker groups have such a field day is because they're big enough and organized enough to have a functional monopoly on space violence, since the restrictive mechanics make conglomeration into large groups the only reasonable solution. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13112	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:13:59 - [93] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Making PVP more accessible, yes. Making PVP more forced and mandatory, no. They are the same thing. Non consensual PvP is the cornerstone of EVE Online, and making highsec PvP more accessible means more wars, more ganking, and more reason to bother defending yourself. And with more ship loss, comes more profit for industrial players, and the economy cycles through more often. Quote: See, you seem to be under the blind assumption that your play style is accepted by all, and what will keep Eve alive and profiting. When in fact, the opposite it true. Oh? Because that kinda flies in the face of CCP's own statements, that those players involved in non consensual PvP have the highest retention rates. And since we know that making them chew on rocks for weeks makes their subs evaporate, it looks like it's pretty clear what really does keep EVE alive and profiting. Quote: HOWEVER, if they want to be big, and bring in a lot more players, they'll have to take a more casual approach. You mean kill the game. Because, you know, every MMO in the history of the genre has died after attempting precisely that. Ultima Online and Star Wars Galaxies being big examples. Quote: What everyone seems to be missing is that CCP is already doing this. They changed the way Concord works, so that they respond faster. They've made normally ganked ships beefier and/or given them accessibility to fit beefier. They made changes to wardecs, though still one sided, gives the target a way out and makes it a bit more costly to the attacker. Changes to awoxing. Changes to the new player experience, which believe it or not, hard cores were against. Removal of med clones. There are likely other changes I can't think of. And yet, player count drops, coinciding nicely with those things happening, too. Looks like most of those were bad things in the long term, despite the claims of the social rejects who try to say that ruining anything good about this game will bring more players. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13112	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:16:46 - [94] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Even after a series of well deserved nerfs, highsec PvP is INSANELY easy. It's no more inherently hard, or easy, than any other kind of PvP. It's ease, or difficulty, is entirely dependent on people's ability to defend themselves competently. You're basically complaining that highsec players suck at the game. But the funny part is that they suck at the game because highsec coddles them so much, that unless they run into the exceedingly rare occurrence of being killed by someone like me, they never have to learn how to play the game correctly. Quote: Untanked industrials and barges continue to litter killboards, and one of C&P's better known miscreants has inflicted billions of ISK in damage on at least a dozen highsec badcorps in the past month alone. You'd wonder why people don't start fitting tanks, then. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13112	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:31:29 - [95] - Quote Nevil Oscillator wrote: You don't use a 1 mil ship for that. The funny part is that they think should be able to make such a bad decision without consequence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13113	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:41:03 - [96] - Quote Nevil Oscillator wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: The funny part is that they think should be able to make such a bad decision without consequence. The only part I sympathise with is the fact the concept of a suicide attack is not very logical compared to other areas of the game. Something about the certainty of Concord is slightly wrong but that doesn't mean it should be easier. Personally, I'd be all for Concord being tankable, but with escalating damage over time. Concord is too binary right now, which is just a heavy handed, outdated mechanic that has no excuse for it's continued existence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13115	Posted - 2015.05.25 00:43:22 - [97] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: How can I freely engage them with no repercussions when they're always docked up waiting out timers? Whose fault is that? It's not ours. The fault belongs to the carebears, and the punitive mechanics you have demanded over the years. The way we behave is how the mechanics allow us to behave, while preserving our playstyles at all. You can't fault us for merely existing, although I know that's your intent anyway. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13115	Posted - 2015.05.25 01:58:21 - [98] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: This has the blind assumption that high sec ganking is hard.. I've killed a Orca, Mackinaw, and a pod with an untanked Caracal before. All at the same time. I see we're into the "lying" phase. I'm not even going to play around and ask how, I'm simply going to tell you that you did not successfully suicide gank those ships with a Caracal, that you're a liar, and that you should probably just drop out of this thread now. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13115	Posted - 2015.05.25 03:00:23 - [99] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: This has the blind assumption that high sec ganking is hard.. I've killed a Orca, Mackinaw, and a pod with an untanked Caracal before. All at the same time. I see we're into the "lying" phase. I'm not even going to play around and ask how, I'm simply going to tell you that you did not successfully suicide gank those ships with a Caracal, that you're a liar, and that you should probably just drop out of this thread now. I didn't say I suicide ganked, now did I? You did say "ganked", yeah. Killing someone in a wardec is not ganking. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13120	Posted - 2015.05.25 12:26:48 - [100] - Quote Mara Pahrdi wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: I just found a comment from a CSM that I find pertinent to this conversation. I'll highlight the most important part. Jayne Fillon wrote: I also think that wardecs are the cancer of Eve, so that's entirely unsurprising. Even if these social groups were being designed with the sole intention of allowing carebears to evade wardecs, you'd still be extremely hard pressed to convince me that it was a bad idea. *Eve is not a PvP game, but a Sandbox game with PvP aspects.* Community is another aspect within the Sandbox, and your misguided attempts to restrict positive player interaction will be the death of this game. Hopefully the only game that dies is the perverted version of Eve that you're convinced should exist. Maybe this CSM should read the official new pilot faq. Section 7. First sentence on p.22. "The essential core concept of EVE Online is that it is full time PvP in a sandbox environment." This. His opinion, CSM or otherwise, does not matter compared to CCP's word on the matter. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13121	Posted - 2015.05.25 13:09:56 - [101] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: You have to consider that quote in context. What context is needed? You claimed you were correct about your nonsense by quoting a CSM who outright says "EVE is not a PvP game". Meanwhile, CCP says "EVE is a PvP game". Directly contradicting Jayne and you. Are you kidding me with this smokescreen bullshit? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13127	Posted - 2015.05.25 23:04:01 - [102] - Quote Mayhaw Morgan wrote: If YOUR core concept of EVE is that you must attack others all the time, should it be any wonder that some others don't want to play with you or subject themselves to mechanics that make them more vulnerable to such attacks? Why do you insist on playing the wrong game? Why do you so constantly demand that your delusions be made reality, instead of playing a game that is actually what you say you want? In all seriousness, to hell with what you want. What you want is pure fascism, to dictate to others how they should be allowed to play, claiming that your playstyle demands the handcuffing of the freedom of others. You sicken me. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13129	Posted - 2015.05.26 01:39:33 - [103] - Quote Yuri Ostrovsky wrote: Also, people, if it weren't for npc corps, or highsec, you wouldn't have any ships or parts to fit. Yall seem to keep forgetting that. I suppose it still hasn't occurred to you that some of the most prolific and seasoned industrialists in all of the game are CODE members, has it? You greatly overestimate your importance to the game. As for Heehaw over there, he's rambling on about how affecting other players isn't just combat, but blithely ignoring the fact that, even if he's not shooting at other people, he is having an effect on their gameplay, an effect to which they should have the recourse of killing him. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13130	Posted - 2015.05.26 01:54:57 - [104] - Quote Yuri Ostrovsky wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Yuri Ostrovsky wrote: Also, people, if it weren't for npc corps, or highsec, you wouldn't have any ships or parts to fit. Yall seem to keep forgetting that. I suppose it still hasn't occurred to you that some of the most prolific and seasoned industrialists in all of the game are CODE members, has it? You greatly overestimate your importance to the game. As for Heehaw over there, he's rambling on about how affecting other players isn't just combat, but blithely ignoring the fact that, even if he's not shooting at other people, he is having an effect on their gameplay, an effect to which they should have the recourse of killing him. See I haven't been playing long enough for Code to mean a damned thing to me, sorry toots. And you can easily infer that ego problem fella. Just look at any Solecist post. That whoosh? That was the sound of the point going over your head. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13133	Posted - 2015.05.26 03:04:29 - [105] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: You want NPC corps dead and carebears corps dead. I want NPC corps to be something besides the obviously superior option. Apparently that means "dead" to the people who cling to that golden goose. As for "carebear" corps, I would rather they be transformed into more all rounder corps, not so skewed in one direction. More variety = more options = more fun. Quote: You want only corps that are willing to fight all the time. That is the mandate of being in a player corp, yes. Go read the last war dev blog. In exchange for the increased risk of being in a player corp, your rewards should be commensurately higher, that's why I want NPC corps nerfed. That whole risk vs reward thing. Quote: You despise PVE and want it done away with. Again, wrong. I simply want PvE to not be given credence as anything more than what it is; the sad necessity that the game requires for use as income generation. I do not want it done away with, but there is zero reason to waste time and money making "new" missions, since the playerbase has shown itself capable of math hammering out the solution to CCP's innovations in a matter of days, when it took CCP months to build it in the first place. That is definitively a waste of time. But I do despise PvE, yes. It is banality incarnate, I would rather play Angry Birds with my thumbs broken than shoot red crosses for more than about forty minutes. I once actually fell asleep in a mission pocket, and my Paladin was still alive when I woke up. >.< Quote: So, troll me more on how My way is wrong and your way should be THE way... I don't think any of those things. I am, however, tired of having my playstyle take a backseat to yours, incessantly nerfed time and again merely because your side has cried louder in the past decade. So now I advocate for my cause, because if I don't, it's rather likely that you and yours will whine it out of existence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13139	Posted - 2015.05.26 11:33:05 - [106] - Quote Mayhaw Morgan wrote: For the record, what IS your playstyle? Back when they still had the playstyle survey, it was called "Pirate". You might have heard of it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13139	Posted - 2015.05.26 11:39:13 - [107] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: I mean, PVP combat is the most imbalanced RvW aspect of Eve. Risk vs reward barely touches on PvP combat, and even then it's only the loot fairy. Risk vs reward applies to activities that generate assets or isk into the game world from nothing, it applies primarily to PvE as a result. In PvP, my risk is pretty much a direct function of the effort put in by the other player. My reward is pretty much a direction function of their stupidity and/or greed. In PvP, that particular metric is left up to the player. Quote: Why go to low to get kills when you can bump and gank a freighter for a loot dump? Well, if I'm just out for money, faction warfare missions are still the most lucrative thing in the game. But I can say much the same thing about highsec, except actually use the risk vs reward metric correctly, since it is generating assets. Why would you go anywhere else, if you can make risk free cash like crazy in highsec incursions? Quote: You make all the claims of RvW but refuse to see how the rewards for PVP in high sec are significantly greater than in low. And that's the fault of the mental deficients who stuff their freighters full of riches, by and large. That said, we gank every freighter now, even the empty ones, just to make a point to you people. And of course, you still never get it, so it continues. Quote: See, this entire thread has been about trying to take away my play style and force more of what you want on to me. There is no playstyle called "I shouldn't have to defend myself". "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13169	Posted - 2015.05.28 10:18:26 - [108] - Quote GetSirrus wrote: So carebears declare war? Half a dozen times or so, I suppose. But statistically, I think that is referred to as an "outlier". Quote: I still have not found a corp for mid-life crisis, shift working, Zen-Buddhists. But I am hopeful. Your standards are too high. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13169	Posted - 2015.05.28 22:58:23 - [109] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: But I don't see a way to solve the first problem beyond some kind of intricate barrier to corp creation. You solve a player created problem with other players. Specifically, those gankers and wardeccers you so despise. Bad corps should die on the vine, but in the ridiculous safety that is highsec, that's far too difficult to do. Incentivize conflict, make it more accessible and more widespread, and watch these bad corps die. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13169	Posted - 2015.05.28 23:43:13 - [110] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Shouldn't be too long before you regret that... Maybe 4 weeks before the market falls apart and the price of everything doubles. If your best argument involves publicly demonstrating that you have zero clue how the economy works, you should have just stayed out of the discussion. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13170	Posted - 2015.05.29 01:33:19 - [111] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: I think you have no clue, of the value high sec players provide to the economy. And the demonstration continues. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13171	Posted - 2015.05.29 03:13:33 - [112] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: This is a game. Not everyone is going to invest the same amount of time, effort, or real world cash that you do. In light of that it is unreasonable to expect people to compete on your terms in every area of the game. So, do I get an easymode because I'm bad at the market? Or does this kind of coddling only apply to combat? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13172	Posted - 2015.05.29 03:16:32 - [113] - Quote Mr Epeen wrote: I'm pretty sure that the sudden loss of a significant portion of the player base is a pretty good justification for keeping immunity. It wasn't a good enough justification for the ISBotters. They can't hold the game hostage by threatening to withdraw their subs anymore, and CCP standing up to that selfish, petty tyranny is a good thing. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13172	Posted - 2015.05.29 03:23:42 - [114] - Quote Tyberius Franklin wrote: The argument you are making now is that the affected players made the wrong choice somehow and need to be forcibly corrected because someone else knows what their game play time should be spent doing better than they do. No, we're making the argument that no one should be able to completely ignore certain parts of the game without consequence, just because they made the deliberate choice to be bad at that part. As before. I suck at the market. Should I get to be immune to that mechanic, just because I'm bad at it? Because this is EXACTLY what you are suggesting should be true about wardecs. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13189	Posted - 2015.05.29 19:33:22 - [115] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: You keep relying on this data as if it has no flaws. The data is not flawed merely because you don't want to face the truth that it presents. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13195	Posted - 2015.05.29 20:44:59 - [116] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: You keep relying on this data as if it has no flaws. The data is not flawed merely because you don't want to face the truth that it presents. The data is not flawed merely because you don't want to face the truth it presents as I see it. "as I see it". Gotta keep pushing that agenda, huh carebear? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13195	Posted - 2015.05.29 20:51:45 - [117] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Only for one side. Getting blown up is content every bit as much as blowing up someone else. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13195	Posted - 2015.05.29 20:56:44 - [118] - Quote Syn Shi wrote: All it took was 4 words to show there is no substance to your words. That was an easy win. Spin all you like, you can't escape the statistics. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13199	Posted - 2015.05.30 00:09:39 - [119] - Quote Mr Epeen wrote: It's not CCPs place to force them out, it's the player corps place to make it an interesting and exciting option to staying in NPC. Except for the part where CCP gives player corps so little to offer. That's their problem, and they need to get around to fixing it. That will mean a big net nerf to NPC corps, once CCP finds the spine to do it. And just like the ISBotters, the NPC corp carebears will cry and howl, but their time of standing in the way of improving the game will finally be at an end. Quote: It's all you whiners in high sec corps not willing to take new players under your wing that's the real problem here. You don't want to do that, it seems. What you want is new players being forced to make one man and small corps of inexperienced players so you can practice the manly art of war griefing for your own risk averse pleasure. I was an awoxer for a long time before CCP decided it wasn't going to be allowed anymore, and as a result I have been in more corps than probably anyone in this thread. The "griefing" corps you are frothing about? They are the friendly, welcoming, helpful ones, the ones who take newbies under their wing and teach them all about the game. You claim otherwise to perpetuate a lie for your own selfish benefit. Quote: So stop with the ranting and raging and start doing something about it. We are, and we always have been. But CCP's PvE centric, boredom oriented design for highsec makes that an uphill battle. Something carebear chickenshits like you work so hard to defend. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13200	Posted - 2015.05.30 01:09:54 - [120] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: You need to figure out what your trying to suggest... Nerf NPC corps or make player corps better? Those two things are equivalent. Personally, I'd like to see both happen. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13200	Posted - 2015.05.30 01:14:53 - [121] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Aaaaand completely ignore the rest of my comments because you can't think of a way to twist them to what you want. No, I ignored them because you're just rambling like a derelict. Quote: NPC corps are fine... No, they're not. They're going to eat a fairly heavy nerf in the fairly near future, I suspect. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13203	Posted - 2015.05.30 01:32:01 - [122] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: Which in turn will do nothing more then prompt player corps to have even more ridiculous standards to get in due to the high traffic fleeing npc corps. My first thought upon reading that sentence. Your ranting afterwards? Well, that's a whole different meme. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13203	Posted - 2015.05.30 01:39:03 - [123] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: See, people exactly like you. You're nothing more then living proof of why we want nothing to do with your corps. Don't even bothering responding, the points been made, and you truly have no counterpoint worth offering. The really funny part is that I wouldn't willingly associate with the likes of you, either. You're so much more useful as targets instead. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13207	Posted - 2015.05.30 01:48:06 - [124] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: At least we can take comfort in knowing you people are no longer forced on us, we're forced on you. You have to deal with us, and not the other way around. Cheers "mate" Don't make me break out the Jackie Chan meme again. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13207	Posted - 2015.05.30 02:02:31 - [125] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Mr Epeen wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: You're so much more useful as targets instead. But they look like people. You don't shoot people. In fact you haven't shot anything in 2015 except a POS. I don't think they need to fear you, really. No sticks and stones. Just empty bravado. Mr Epeen Well you see, when you can't awox anymore, your combat capabilities are pretty limited... Kinda hard to kill people when you don't know how they're fit. More like it's rather hard to juggle overheats and active reps with an infant on my lap, but push whatever narrative you two desire. Although it is rather fun to see a dedicated forum alt play at **** measuring with killboards. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13207	Posted - 2015.05.30 02:07:44 - [126] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: If you were looking to discredit yourself, you could have just said "well, as a mother...." Instead. Your error lies in the assumption that I, or anyone, gives a crap what a worthless NPC alt thinks. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13207	Posted - 2015.05.30 02:10:44 - [127] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: How does an infant keep you from PVP with one character, but not the other? Because faction warfare is fly and die with cheap little frigates? If you don't care if you live, you can use one hand. Do try to pay attention. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13207	Posted - 2015.05.30 02:13:48 - [128] - Quote Mr Epeen wrote: Of course. And your other car is a Porsche. Nope, I drive a Subaru. Quote: Pretty lame to use the old, "My other super secret alt is the real killer" gambit. Says the self acknowledged forum alt? Get over yourself, puffball. Besides, pretty sure if I were to check the FW character, her killboard would suck. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13208	Posted - 2015.05.30 02:19:50 - [129] - Quote Joe Risalo wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Joe Risalo wrote: How does an infant keep you from PVP with one character, but not the other? Because faction warfare is fly and die with cheap little frigates? If you don't care if you live, you can use one hand. Do try to pay attention. I can't imagine what you do with that other hand when you're enjoying the destruction of weak targets. Sampling fine whines, of course. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13216	Posted - 2015.05.30 12:45:18 - [130] - Quote Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: So over the last 60 pages, why haven't we seen anyone actually offer any incentives to join thier corps? For my part, I simply haven't seen anyone posting on the NPC side who I'd want to hang out with. The majority of you are only posting here to defend the racket you have going, and I wouldn't be interested in playing the game with people like that. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13216	Posted - 2015.05.30 12:58:31 - [131] - Quote BrundleMeth wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: So over the last 60 pages, why haven't we seen anyone actually offer any incentives to join thier corps? For my part, I simply haven't seen anyone posting on the NPC side who I'd want to hang out with. The majority of you are only posting here to defend the racket you have going, and I wouldn't be interested in playing the game with people like that. I have no racket going...and I am an extremely nice guy... Want to join CODE? Our wardec arm has finally finished reorganizing, and we have a bunch of decs going. Or you can join New Order Logistics, and get started with some ganking. We happily accept alts, although if you're just there to spy on our teamspeak you will probably be purged. The only condition is that you have to guess the password to the minerbumping channel. But it should be a pretty easy guess. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13219	Posted - 2015.05.30 19:34:47 - [132] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Only for one side. Getting blown up is content every bit as much as blowing up someone else. You're missing the point. No, I'm really not. My dumb ass lost an Ashimmu to a corp we decced the other day just a few hours ago, and it was still content, I still had fun, and I still acknowledged their "gf" in local. That's called playing the game, and being a good sport. In other news, as mentioned before, trying to play EVE with a baby on your lap is tricky. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13220	Posted - 2015.05.30 19:53:36 - [133] - Quote kes88 wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Only for one side. Getting blown up is content every bit as much as blowing up someone else. You're missing the point. No, I'm really not. My dumb ass lost an Ashimmu to a corp we decced the other day just a few hours ago, and it was still content, I still had fun, and I still acknowledged their "gf" in local. That's called playing the game, and being a good sport. In other news, as mentioned before, trying to play EVE with a baby on your lap is tricky. Hopefully getting the wee one stuck in at an early age, lol. Ostensibly, yes, but it's mostly that the flashing images keeps him amused, and therefore not crying. My wife isn't in good health, so I take the baby a lot on my days off. My older daughter? Oh, she loves it when I play games, she yells at me to kill them harder. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13220	Posted - 2015.05.30 21:25:25 - [134] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: And where were your neutral logi? I don't use any, I never have. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13221	Posted - 2015.05.31 00:41:09 - [135] - Quote It shouldn't even surprise me that someone like you can't figure out that fun isn't measured in isk. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13221	Posted - 2015.05.31 00:52:19 - [136] - Quote Demerius Xenocratus wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: It shouldn't even surprise me that someone like you can't figure out that fun isn't measured in isk. Brawling a properly fit rattlesnake is not my idea of fun. What were you thinking? Thought I could chance a moment to grab my kid, since he was crying. shrugs If it flies, it dies. I'm no exception. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13222	Posted - 2015.05.31 11:30:15 - [137] - Quote March rabbit wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Yuri Ostrovskoy wrote: So over the last 60 pages, why haven't we seen anyone actually offer any incentives to join thier corps? For my part, I simply haven't seen anyone posting on the NPC side who I'd want to hang out with. The majority of you are only posting here to defend the racket you have going, and I wouldn't be interested in playing the game with people like that. Not sure if i would like to hang out with people from CODE. Why might that be? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13296	Posted - 2015.06.04 11:24:43 - [138] - Quote Nevil Oscillator wrote: Lucas Kell wrote: With wardecs, the most common reason to dec somone is for easy kills. This is why nearly 90% of all wardecs in which kills were made were won by the aggressor. I imagine most war decs are declared by someone who thinks they can win. Poland should have dec dodged. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13296	Posted - 2015.06.04 11:46:29 - [139] - Quote Tipa Riot wrote: There are significant differences between wardecs and suicide ganking. The most important one is that you can easily avoid being ganked. Wardecs throw a corp into "nullsec". Maybe if you live in a trade hub. My old alliance, The ROC, was decced by Marmite for a little over two months because we pissed off some lowsec entity with deep pockets. The entire time, they had a five man presence in Rens every time I was logged in to see them. More, with logi and scouts. But we lived less than half a dozen jumps from Rens, we did not move, and I never saw them on grid once. I was missioning in a faction battleship the whole time, helping newbies with salvage and standings. Never lost it, never even got in danger of losing it. At one point I had to leave my keyboard for two hours because my building had a fire drill that went awry, and my battleship was STILL alive. (I was actually disappointed that I was still alive) Were our miners getting killed? You betcha, but they were afk, they would have died to a suicide ganker every bit as much as to Marmite. "nullsec"? Don't make me laugh. Wardecs or no wardecs, highsec is exceedingly safe. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13299	Posted - 2015.06.04 13:37:40 - [140] - Quote Tipa Riot wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: "nullsec"? Don't make me laugh. Wardecs or no wardecs, highsec is exceedingly safe. Though some say nullsec is safer than highsec ... ... but then war deccers are sh** in hunting people. The skill of the person doing the hunting really isn't all that relevant. Bad or good, everyone shows up in local. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13302	Posted - 2015.06.04 16:38:24 - [141] - Quote Tipa Riot wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Tipa Riot wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: "nullsec"? Don't make me laugh. Wardecs or no wardecs, highsec is exceedingly safe. Though some say nullsec is safer than highsec ... ... but then war deccers are sh** in hunting people. The skill of the person doing the hunting really isn't all that relevant. Bad or good, everyone shows up in local. Sure, leave corp, get to system, scan down, approach, get back to corp, shoot. GG That's hugely against the rules, last I heard. As in, first offense, perma ban. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13329	Posted - 2015.06.07 10:27:37 - [142] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Omar Alharazaad wrote: Do you don your cheerleading outfit and heels and run shrieking into the woods at night? Or do you strap on your hockey mask and grab your favorite machete for your moonlit walk through the forest? There is a 3rd option; you don your cheerleading outfit and hockey mask, grab your machete; then make someone having a moonlit walk through the forest run off shrieking. Lollipop Chainsaw much? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13339	Posted - 2015.06.08 16:18:20 - [143] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: That's what happens. People leave those corps to avoid the wardec. Without the social aspect and the assistance provided within those corps the players just leave Eve. If the price of their sub is the removal of non consensual PvP, then it's no big loss. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13339	Posted - 2015.06.08 16:38:46 - [144] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: How would changing the mechanics of high sec war decs remove non consensual PvP? The same way that "changing the mechanics" of awoxing removed non consensual PvP. In the end, there is much less non consensual PvP. That is, without exception, a bad thing. Besides, I'd like to see your reasoning behind why wardecs, an already weak mechanic, would need to be made still weaker. Quote: It's one thing to war dec someone to take a bunch of POCOs, there's something tangible that the attacker is trying to obtain. Whenever the attacker is doing it solely for the lulz and it's clearly hurting NPE I'd say that's a problem. Except that, per CCP themselves, doing it just for lulz increases net retention of new players. Those involved in PvP combat are an order of magnitude more likely to resub. I'd say that's not only not a problem, but it's something that needs to be proliferated, since we know it has a net positive effect. Quote: There's a reason why Marmite and the like aren't out there war decing entities that have the experience necessary to put up a fight. You mean like Goonswarm, one of the largest groups in the game, with some of the most experienced players, whom Marmite has had decced more often than not? Or how about when Marmite and CODE were deccing one another a while back? Or maybe you just don't have a clue what you're talking about? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13339	Posted - 2015.06.08 16:54:13 - [145] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: You are absolutely correct in that I don't know much relative to you about Eve. I'm just a dude that has seen the effects of the repeated war decs. And I'm telling you that your anecdotes don't mean a thing compared to what CCP has told us about the matter. Quote: Have they not effectively nerfed the ability for people to make ISK in high sec with the changes to Industry? Nope. Highsec is, beyond the rest of the game combined, the largest point of "creation" on that delightful dotted map they gave us some time ago. Quote: Why not do it more and make high sec safer for newbros? If you make "highsec" less than two dozen systems, sure. Quote: Hey, maybe I'm wrong. But I believe that player retention would go up. You are wrong. Space violence is directly correlated with increased retention. That's not up for debate. Quote: Players would be able to thrive and learn the game, but would likely want to seek better opportunities while understanding the risks of low and null sec. That's what highsec has been for the past decade. It doesn't work. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13339	Posted - 2015.06.08 17:11:07 - [146] - Quote Aza Ebanu wrote: Okay so people keep confusing wardec with "non consensual PVP". It is not non consensual PVP it is a change in the security status for a single corporation. One that they did not agree to. Or, put a different way, they did not consent to. Quote: EVE is supposed to be harsh, why make it so easy on criminals? Because wars are not criminal activity. They are lawful activity. Also because everyone is supposed to die, and no one is supposed to be exempt. Ships getting blown up turns the wheels of the economy. Further, because wars act as a much needed isk sink. Still further, whether you like it or not, highsec PvP combat is pretty much the only thing in highsec left with such restrictions and punishments on their playstyle. Yours certainly has none, now that standings have been decoupled from station use. Thus, we are enabled to be the risk that is lacking from your otherwise easymode playstyle(s). We are what makes EVE harsh. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 17:31:52 - [147] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: People are getting no-risk money with stupid incursions, meanwhile CODE thinks they're doing something so useful by griefing new players. First of all, it's not "griefing" by the only definition that matters, CCP's definition. Secondly, according to the only authority that matters, CCP, new players getting blown up directly correlates to their likelihood of subscribing to the game. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 17:36:20 - [148] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Honestly dude I dont care what you think, or what definitions you feel are so important to use. Your entity is a scourge to the game bottom line. Except that we're not. In fact, by all indications, we're a distinct and noticeable positive, whether you like it or not. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:39:25 - [149] - Quote March rabbit wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: We are what makes EVE harsh. (takes notes) Hm.... that's interesting... So to change nature of the game to something more popular and interesting CCP only needs to ban some people.... Is this another of your "Flat Earth" theories? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:40:56 - [150] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13344	Posted - 2015.06.08 18:46:57 - [151] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: The fact is that you're pissing in a smaller and smaller pool, and either you don't realize that or you don't care. That is why you are basically a cockroach. Tell me how you really feel. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:07:31 - [152] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: Kaarous Aldurald wrote: xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: but to be blown up over and over doesn't directly correlate to their likelihood of unsubscribing from the game? Nope. It's time for you carebears to conjure up a new bullshit narrative. That one's worn out. LOL the silly CODE role player thinks i'm a carebear hahahahahaha. thanks for the link. i stand corrected. Carebear is a state of mind, my friend. The point stands regardless. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:15:10 - [153] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: and yes the points stands, care to share your feelings on that once more. Certainly. Counter to the assertions of some, including in this thread, ganking in general does not cost subs. And that's the end of it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13347	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:25:32 - [154] - Quote xxxTRUSTxxx wrote: to say it costs none is a lie and you know it. Net, obviously. And as before, regarding new players, as per the link I provided. Quote: so you're not willing to go into what you think a carebear is? i wonder why A carebear is someone who opposes the existence of non consensual PvP. Typically, they do so out of selfishness as they would stand to benefit from the removal of such. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13350	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:36:15 - [155] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Ruminating on "carebears" ls literally 10 yrs ago tech. look at the population right now and be a real person. You mean the population that goes lower and lower, while highsec gets safer and safer? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13353	Posted - 2015.06.08 19:49:47 - [156] - Quote Vimsy Vortis wrote: A carebear then is someone who doesn't acknowledge that by undocking they are consenting to PVP. Someone gets the point. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13354	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:02:47 - [157] - Quote Teckos Pech wrote: snip What do you think? "should the game be changed for those who don't like PvP to try and keep them subscribed?" No. PvP is the founding pillar upon which EVE Online is based. They're welcome to their playstyle as much as anyone else, but never it they want to claim that their playstyle is "I shouldn't have to defend myself". Furthermore, as CCP has demonstrated for us with the Burner rats content, any PvE that CCP devises can be math hammered out and made trivial in far, far less time than it took a CCP employee to generate that content. New PvE content that is not fundamentally dynamic therefore, becomes a waste of effort, as it is trivialized entirely too quickly. Heck, these new multiplayer Drifter dungeons they have devised? They had to keep them a secret until launch, or people would have min maxed their way through that one too. As for, as you put them, "The edge case PvP players", I believe that there are more of them in the game than meets the eye. I don't think that everyone who mines or runs missions is a hopeless, iredeemable carebear. I think the NPE wrongly pushes players in that direction and ONLY in that direction, and that player conflict being so handcuffed in highsec is strongly contributing to that. Consequently, I assign that as a large contributing factor as to why people unsub from boredom of chewing rocks. I hear time and again from miners and missioners that they "like" things the way they are, that they find such content "fun". Clearly, not all of them do, or they wouldn't be quitting in such numbers. Perhaps it's the very people who claim that they enjoy banality that are keeping this game from being improved for everyone else? In summary, I believe that a PvE centric approach for the NPE, and highsec, is a proven failure. And I believe that CCP can't ignore that for too much longer, so the sacred cows of Concord, NPC corps and Incursions will find themselves approaching the guillotine. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13354	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:11:55 - [158] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: Ganking is the most boring form of PvP however. Says the tireless defender of ISBotter? You don't have anything to say but your usual drivel. Be gone. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13355	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:34:16 - [159] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Well... you could start by having them have something other Incursions and L4 missions to make them some damn money. If they try industry, they're fking dead. This is just funny, and it shows a fundamental lack of understanding about the market. Incursions and L4s devalue everything else in the game, thanks to their sheer safety, ease of farming, and endless sustainability. Meanwhile, you bitterly spit vitriol at the only people trying to do something about that, complaining that industry is "fking dead". If more ships exploded, there would be a greater demand for industrially produced items. And if there wasn't one best, obvious choice for personal income above all else, people across disparate playstyle groups would have better purchasing power to drive sales. It's really funny to see you scream about how you hate the way you've made your own bed. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13355	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:35:56 - [160] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: At no point did I defend ISBoxer. Ha ha, what? That's damn near all you did for a solid month. Quote: Right back from the beginning I was suggesting better ways to make ISBoxer useless without having to risk banning manual multiboxers. They were never at risk, barring the obvious lies and smokescreen from the bot apologists in that thread, yourself included. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13356	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:44:49 - [161] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: That's why I think ganking should be the danger in high sec. War decs would be to take over structures or something of high value. I don't think any one thing should be "the" danger in highsec. (or just two things, either) Only one thing is only one thing to watch out for. And I don't think it should be that simple, or that restricted. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13356	Posted - 2015.06.08 20:54:36 - [162] - Quote March rabbit wrote: Truth be told lately i see a lot more whine and cry from Feyd, Kaarous and 'pro-pvp' company than from so called 'carebears'. Something happened.... For my part, I never used to get on the forums at all until a few years ago. Then I got tired of there being only one voice presented to CCP on the forums. If you'll notice, I'm not the one making threads. I just answer them. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13356	Posted - 2015.06.08 21:05:32 - [163] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: I think making war decs cost prohibitive for just trolling would go a long way. CCP thought that too. Before they did precisely that, wardec groups were smaller and sporadic compared to these days. Increasing costs just forced people to conglomerate into larger groups to preserve their playstyle. Now we have much larger groups. It was much the same with ganking. People didn't used to min/max ganking down to minutiae, they did that in response to carebears crying for more "consequences" against their playstyle. Now they have to behave the way they do, if they want to preserve the way they play the game at all. And carebears still cry that ganking needs more punishments, and the only proof they offer is that ganking still happens at all, so it must need "just one more nerf", yet again. Their goal is not game balance, and it never was. Their endgame is the removal of PvP from highsec. Restrictions are only going to raise the bar further, meaning that any wardec groups that survive the added restrictions are going to be increasingly impossible to take on for the average carebear group, who hasn't had to survive any adversity, because their playstyles don't have any. And so on until the only thing left is to ban it outright, or functionally remove it just like with awoxing. Loosening the decade of unreasonable restrictions is the way forward. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13356	Posted - 2015.06.08 21:14:09 - [164] - Quote Orion Nex wrote: If those high sec groups were able to operate a bit without getting shut down with war decs they'd soon find as others have pointed out that the margins suck and they'd need to find something better to generate ISK. They can already, wars can be trivially dodged without consequence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13375	Posted - 2015.06.09 21:03:33 - [165] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: Lol, you're the one doing all the damage control following the exodus cause by your first wardec. "The truth is whatever I feel like it should be!" ~Lucas Kell, 2015. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13376	Posted - 2015.06.09 23:55:13 - [166] - Quote Lucas Kell wrote: So your corp falls apart under a wardec just like the many carebears you like to talk down to. Ignore the rebuttal, repeat the lie and hope it sticks. Reminds me of one of the most left-wing of my old college professors. I bet you'll vote for Hilary, too. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.
Kaarous Aldurald Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE. 13378	Posted - 2015.06.10 00:39:58 - [167] - Quote Jenn aSide wrote: I listened to your CSM interviews, you could actually contribute something if you could get past your issues. Between the military and the financial industry before that, I've dealt with enough intellectually dishonest people to know irredeemable when I see it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs. Best Meltdown Ever.

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